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Saturday, July 1, 2017

Pedophiles, Part II

I realized about two-thirds of the way through the comments on the previous post that I had approached this topic the wrong way. I should have framed it by saying that if the LGBT movement believes its own central tenet about not being able to help one's sexuality, then they should accept the pedophiles as their fellow brothers in arms. Not to do so is hypocritical.

After all, if you believe that pedophiles should be reviled and should stay in the closet because of their aberrant sexuality, then perhaps gays should, too.

The gays answer that by saying activities between consenting adults is a completely different matter than the exploitation of children. And, of course, they're right about that. But as I made clear in the previous post, I don't condone child abuse either: the only change I'd suggest is the legalization of CGI-generated child porn. (I'd strengthen the laws against actual child molestation.)

A friend sent an email in which he suggested that that internet porn only be made available to those who agreed to register for it. I think that's a good suggestion. Of course, a lot of pedos would be reluctant to come forward to register. But, if they want their porn, they'd have to.

In any case, the hypocrisy of the LGBT movement in not accepting pedophiles -- at least those who don't actually molest actual children -- would have made for a better argument.

Interestingly, the gay liberation movement initially accepted NAMBLA as part of their movement. According to Wikipedia:

In 1993, the International Lesbian and Gay Association (ILGA) achieved United Nations consultative status. NAMBLA's membership of ILGA drew heavy criticism and caused the suspension of ILGA. Many gay organizations called for the ILGA to dissolve ties with NAMBLA. Republican Senator Jesse Helms proposed a bill to withhold US$119 million in UN contributions until U.S. President Bill Clinton could certify that no UN agency grants any official status to organizations that condoned pedophilia. The bill was unanimously approved by Congress and signed into law by Clinton in April 1994.

In 1994, ILGA expelled NAMBLA— the first U.S.-based organization to be a member—as well as Vereniging Martijn and Project Truth, because they were judged to be "groups whose predominant aim is to support or promote pedophilia." Although ILGA removed NAMBLA, the UN reversed its decision to grant ILGA special consultative status. Repeated attempts by ILGA to regain special status with the UN succeeded in 2006.

In other words, the gays decided it hurt their own cause to be associated with pedophiles, so they cut them loose for tactical reasons. But, at least at first, they recognized the common principle uniting them all. 

Writing the previous post, as I told commenter Steven, made me think of the three child molesters I've known. The first was my YMCA swimming coach in high school, who struck me as a nice guy at the time. Of course, I had no idea about his predilection when I was swimming for him, and wouldn't have suspected it, since he was married with a son. (This guy actually acted on his impulses later on, and was convicted for it.)

The second was a guy I knew when I was in my twenties and lived in Los Angeles; his apartment shared a balcony with mine. This guy was a couple years older than me. He struck me as a pleasant, gentle guy. I was surprised when he told me he had joined Big Brothers of America. At first I couldn't figure out why he would want to spend his free time with some snot-nosed fatherless kid when he could be out having fun; then I concluded that he was simply a nicer guy than me. He never expressed any interest in girls, but I never really thought about that at the time. It was only a few years later that it struck me what he was about. 

The third guy was a middle-aged man who had been pointed out to me as a probable pedophile at the Y where I now work out. He hasn't been there for the past ten years or so, and I'm assuming he was kicked out (though I don't know that for sure). He never actually exercised, but would only show up to hang out in the locker room when the kids' swim team was practicing.

Anyway, the point is that what all three of these guys had in common was that they were physically wimpy. Not a muscle to be seen among the three of them, and all three were short as well. Meaning, they were low on testosterone -- one more clue that, as with gays and lesbians, their sexuality was probably at least partially a function of their hormone levels.

The most famous pedophile of all, Michael Jackson, was another piece of circumstantial evidence for this: he was abnormally skinny and had that weirdly high-pitched voice.

I've always had some sympathy for Jackson, who was reportedly fed female hormones by his father when he was about to reach puberty so that his voice wouldn't change, and the Jackson Five could continue to be a cash-generating machine.

When your own father sabotages you like that, that's just a really, really tough spot to be in.

And -- though I find them personally revolting -- I have some sympathy for pedophiles in general, since they can't help but be what they are.

It seems a little hypocritical for the LGBT movement not to feel that way as well.

13 comments:

Anonymous said...

A lot of LGBT people do recognise that paedos probably can't help how they feel. Feeling something and acting it out are different things though, and the latter is illegal. Law-abiding people not wanting association with violent criminals is hardly hypocrisy.

I've told you before - on the post about Martin Shkreli - that you can't tell a man (or woman's) testosterone levels by looking at them. I know this from personal experience: a blood test showed my T levels to be dangerously high, so much that I was at risk of liver damage, and yet I've always been thin. Testosterone alone doesn't create big muscles (plenty of acne, hunger, energy and libido, though!). Unless the person is a bodybuilder, the high T won't make a tremendous amount of difference to muscle mass (and even if he's a bodybuilder, T still isn't the magic chemical it's made out to be - genetics and nutrition comes into it too). So please quit spreading the idea that scrawny guys necessarily have low T. And WTF do you think height has to do with it? High T levels during the teenage years *stunts* growth. Conversely, the reduced T levels caused by Klinefelter syndrome is why males with the syndrome are usually tall.

- Gethin

John Craig said...

Gethin --
You're right about feeling something and acting on those impulses being different, and NAMBLA itself advocated actual contact with children, which by just about anyone's definition is wrong. But the gay movement -- officially, at least -- has dissociated itself from pedophiles entirely, and that doesn't seem right to me given their central tenet which I keep referring to.

And yes, testosterone alone doesn't create big muscles, of course exercise and nutrition are needed: but if testosterone doesn't increase muscle size, why is it that when people take steroids they inevitably get bigger? There's definitely a correlation there, even if it's not perfect.

As far as height, I don't have any statistics to back me up, but it's my general impression that a disproportionate number of the gay guys I've know or have seen around (think Truman Capote types) are of below average height. And on a somewhat related note, it seems that a disproportionate number of the very tall women I've known or known of (think WNBA) are lesbians. This is a much weaker correlation, admittedly, and there are certainly plenty of examples going the other way, but it does seem to be a positive correlation. Again, I've seen no numbers on this, it's just a vague impression.

And yes, there is such a thing as Klinefelter's Syndrome, or XXY syndrome, and people with it (I just read up on it) can often be taller. (They also have less testosterone, and less muscle, by the way.) But that's a rare exception from which I wouldn't draw more general conclusions. There's also Marfan's syndrome, which results in abnormally tall individuals with slender limbs, and there's also such a thing as eunuchoidal infantile gigantism, otherwise known as daddy-longlegs syndrome, which results in abnormal height and lack of muscle. But I wouldn't draw general conclusions from this conditions either.

Also, btw, as far as your case, keep in mind that the "expression" of testosterone is a function of not only testosterone levels, but also the number of androgen receptors you have in your body. (I use "testosterone" as shorthand for testosterone + androgen receptors.) I heard something surprising recently, which is that Indian men (from India) have among the highest testosterone levels in the world, but have fewer androgen receptors, which is why they tend not to get particularly muscular.

Steven said...

The same thing occured to me- that you could give cgi porn to paedophiles who were willing to come forward and register. That way they could get some gratification in return for making themselves known, agreeing to some restrictions and therefore rendering themselves less dangerous. It sounds like a fair deal in a way. But then you realise that in the internet age nothing like that could stay under wraps. It'd be freely available online quicker than you could say Lolita. Then it occurred to me that maybe they could go in somewhere to watch it but at that point the practical difficulties are mounting. And who makes it? Jesus!

I know I have very little interest in watching adult cgi porn so will they really want to watch that? Would it be worth coming forward for?

John Craig said...

Steven --
All good points. You thought of the practicalities and reality of the situation more than i did.

Steven said...

I appreciate the philosophical points but the devil is in the details as they say...

Anonymous said...

Michael Jackson was a molester, but I am unsure if he was a full blown rapist.

The tolerance for pedophilia among LGBT is a bit higher, true, the one part of the Vagina Monologues about a 13 year old girl and an adult woman (but thank god they changed her to 16 in recent editions! /s).

About Japan (which I mentioned in the previous post), I am unsure about rape, but sexual assault I suspect is higher and tolerated to some degree. The high school girl for rent thing in Akihabara also is a bit unnerving. They are law abiding but the sexual culture is dysfunctional (going back centuries).

I did mention their legal drawn child porn, and I am not sure if CGI is any different, it may be even disturbing (uncanny valley). So I don't know if it can ever replace what they crave, even Hentai may be more appealing than whatever the hell that looks like Tom Hanks in the Polar Express (shudders).

One thing I wonder that may do something is to mentally reboot them, have a person with the urges abstain from any mental stimulation involving a child then see if they can mature to their correct age.

-Ga

John Craig said...

Ga --
Michael Jackson molested boys around the ages of 11 and 12, which means he committed statutory rape, which, technically, is rape. But yes, I see what you mean.

To be honest, that "mental reboot" sounds a little farfetched, a little science-fiction-y, to me.

Anonymous said...

Well they try it with people with OCD, sometimes it helps, sometimes it doesn't. The other possible treatment is progesterone to chemically castrate a person. They used to give saltpetre to prisoners in the old days to stop them from feeling horny, but I have no idea if that worked or was some old folk crap like sasparilla for syphilis.

-Ga

Anonymous said...

The very word 'gay' (in relation to homosexuality) started from the acronym "good as you": the idea being that homos were otherwise just as law-abiding, hardworking and moral as heteros. That's the central tenet of the LGBT movement, not simply about feelings. This is why we don't want association with rapists, regardless of whether or not their feelings are natural.

Don't get me wrong: T alone does increase muscle mass even without exercise (this I know from personal experience), but not to the extent of turning a skinny person bulky. So a scrawny-looking guy could still have astronomically high T levels and plenty of T receptors too, hence displaying the androgenic effects of high T (i.e. high libido) without the anabolic effects (i.e. bulky muscles).

I looked up what you said on homosexuality and height. Lesbians do seem to be taller, but the research on gay men is inconclusive:

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/0191886996000451
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0301051101001314
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0191886997001116

Interesting about the Indian men. I had noticed how men from that region seem to have higher voices than Western men (lots of T receptors usually leads to a deep voice). I've never met an Indian guy whose voice I'd estimate as being deeper than tenor. There doesn't seem to be any research backing up this observation, but an online search shows I'm not the only one to notice it.

- Gethin

John Craig said...

Ga --
I've heard the stories about saltpeter too, but am also unsure whether it' a myth or not.

John Craig said...

Gethin --
i'd never hardhat before about "gay" being an acronym (and I'm old enough to remember when the word started being used that way, around 1970).

And yes, we all seem to have biological set limits to our muscularity. Plus, what we do up until the age of 23 or so seems to matter more than after. If you weight lift a lot before 23 or so, you can gain a lot of strength, but after, generally the best you can do is maintain, unless you take steroids or an exogenous source of testosterone.

I had my testosterone level checked in the summer of '15 for the first time ever (I wrote about it on the blog) and it turned out to be average. I'd always figured I was probably about average, but that my level of female hormones was below average (for a guy). I have an average amount of muscle (5' 11", 160), but very little fat. Since 23 I've lifted pretty regularly (as well as swum) but I've never been able to put on any more muscle.

Anonymous said...

I heard it from a history teacher (she said the slogan started a while before "gay" was used as a synonym for homo). There's a book about "good as you": https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/good-as-you-from-prejudice-to-pride-30-years-of-gay-britain-by-paul-flynn-vw95j936t

Since we're on the topic of T, I figured you'd be interested in this article about how it causes more snap decisions and less reflection: https://psychcentral.com/news/2017/04/29/testosterone-linked-to-snap-judgments-less-reflection/119821.html

It would explain why men are more likely to be criminals, Darwin Awards winners and generally more competitive and adventurous than women. Actually, it's not just men - male mammals are more daring across the board.

- Gethin

John Craig said...

Gethin --
I wonder if it's possible that the "gay as you" acronym sprang up after the word became common usage.

That makes sense about testosterone. I often know I must be tired because I have a hard time making up my mind about something, and I suppose thats when testosterone is at a low ebb too. (Although I suppose it could also just be a function of the tiredness and the fact that my brain is working more slowly as a result.)

Yeah, testosterone has all sorts of effects on behavior. It's also interesting how is molds the brain; men and women just perceive things differently, as a rule. And, as I'll tell women whenever I'm in the mood to be obnoxious, just about all the great geniuses in history were men. (And actually, now that I think of it, being in the mood to be obnoxious is a male trait in itself.)