tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5794535954827182754.post1210789983806926355..comments2024-02-17T04:06:00.805-05:00Comments on Just Not Said: Alcohol and alcoholicsJohn Craighttp://www.blogger.com/profile/08729625146043379286noreply@blogger.comBlogger25125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5794535954827182754.post-17741555596137733422016-05-10T21:52:35.001-04:002016-05-10T21:52:35.001-04:00 Disease, or personality disorder? Disease, or personality disorder?stylecouncilerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05702739047257874061noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5794535954827182754.post-62538145473699000252016-05-10T19:01:40.114-04:002016-05-10T19:01:40.114-04:00Andrew --
As long as you don't make it a regul...Andrew --<br />As long as you don't make it a regular thing, that's a good use for it. <br /><br />I have to admit, I've had a drink or two a couple times in the past before giving a public speech. I suppose you could call that medicating away a trauma as well. John Craighttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08729625146043379286noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5794535954827182754.post-18918059371766060282016-05-10T18:50:24.599-04:002016-05-10T18:50:24.599-04:00I use alcohol to self medicate anxiety/trauma. I c...I use alcohol to self medicate anxiety/trauma. I can almost never relax (not since my mid 30's). But have also used sporadically to treat anxiety since I was 12 years old. <br /><br />Alcohol is great because it does work and you can feel can normal for a while. Especially for trauma. I try and only use it when I'm in really unbearable pain. <br /><br />Being drunk (or even a two beers buzz) isn't as good as just being content(mentally healthy).<br /><br />AndrewAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5794535954827182754.post-67896053650472826852016-05-10T17:25:39.307-04:002016-05-10T17:25:39.307-04:00Anon --
Your father may well have had that problem...Anon --<br />Your father may well have had that problem. They say that nicotine also has a calming effect. Still, between the two habits, that adds up to a lot of self-destructiveness. John Craighttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08729625146043379286noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5794535954827182754.post-88318967516838526572016-05-10T17:18:42.154-04:002016-05-10T17:18:42.154-04:00one reason my grandfather sold the bar, it did sta...one reason my grandfather sold the bar, it did start effecting his liver, so around age 60 he started to cut back dramatically. His brother died of cirrhosis and he wanted to avoid the same fate. <br /><br />I think my father may have had an anxiety condition, which is why he drank so much. He could never relax , but after a few drinks he was mellow, and never became a loud boisterous drunk. but he probably did lose 10 IQ points. Funny that even my mother's family thought she was over reacting to his drinking, because they rarely saw him drunk. he would never drink too much around the holidays or at family gatherings. But he finally admitted he probably had a drinking problem when he was about 55. he died at 59 from lung disease, due to his heavy smoking.<br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5794535954827182754.post-10134562341641745402016-05-10T15:16:21.459-04:002016-05-10T15:16:21.459-04:00Anon --
You're right, there ARE different type...Anon --<br />You're right, there ARE different types of drunks and alcoholics, and I was probably generalizing too much. <br /><br />Wow, your grandfather had some capacity. You never know about health habits and longevity. My grandfather smoked a pack a day till he was in his 80's, then cut down to just a few cigarettes a day, and lived to be 103. (Me, I've lived like a Puritan fitness fanatic my whole life and was just diagnosed with prostate cancer at 61.)<br /><br />Interesting about the delayed effect with you and your Dad. Your theory about absorbing it in the intestine rather than stomach makes sense.John Craighttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08729625146043379286noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5794535954827182754.post-14580691807167078932016-05-10T15:07:44.144-04:002016-05-10T15:07:44.144-04:00there are different types of drunks and alcoholics...there are different types of drunks and alcoholics. My father would be considered an alcoholic, as would his father (my Grandfather). my father drank 5 or 6 nights each week, but only got drunk once or twice a week..he was always pleasant to be around when he had a few drinks, and I avoided him when he was on the wagon. He would hit the bars after work almost every night, but usually made it home for dinner except Friday nights. It bothered my mother a lot. He thought my mother was crazy for criticizing his drinking, since he never missed a day of work. My grandfather owned a bar and drank 10-12 shots of whiskery each night while he was tending bar. But he would only get drunk a few times each year. When he was 65 he sold the bar and then would only drink moderately about once a month, he lived to 94. his longtime girlfriend would start drinking beer at noon each and everyday, she drank about 12-14 beers each day and I never saw her drunk. (maybe I never saw her sober) She was a grandmother to me, since his wife died when he was 40 and he started dating her.<br /><br />one issue I noticed with my dad and me, 2 drinks has no effect on us. Thus we tend to drink faster and more to get a buzz. My father could drink a 6 pack and be fine, and would seem fine after 8 drinks, but then an hour later the booze would catch up with him. not sure if others have this, I could drink 6 or 7 drinks and appear fine, but then 2 hours after I stop I am more intoxicated than an hour earlier. It seems we don't absorb the booze quickly thru our stomach, but it gets absorbed in our intestines thus the delayed effect. Some people have more of this enzyme which slows down the absorption of booze.<br />I rarely drink now, stopped drinking when I was 25 because I started getting hangovers. I still don't know how my dad drank so much up until he was 55, since he had a physical job, worked in a warehouse loading trucks and boxcars.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5794535954827182754.post-75116860628475967842016-05-09T21:30:50.170-04:002016-05-09T21:30:50.170-04:00Mark --
My son is actually fairly lighthearted abo...Mark --<br />My son is actually fairly lighthearted about these things, he was being at least semi-facetious in most of his comments, he's not really declaring a fatwa. Agreed, we all have different types. <br /><br />You could be right about Bush; maybe he was trying to win Putin over, thaw relations. But he sot of made himself a laughingstock with the way he tried to do it. John Craighttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08729625146043379286noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5794535954827182754.post-61502531124383927902016-05-09T21:03:30.454-04:002016-05-09T21:03:30.454-04:00Is it proper to comment on the post you linked to ...Is it proper to comment on the post you linked to about 10's in this post? Perhaps, you could reply to this comment in a post about Hillary. Your son should lighten up. He is delusional or fairly handsome so his perspective is different than his average guy friends. As far as tens go, I have a type so my ten is going to be different than your ten. It shouldn't be extremely different but different. Conversely, I can recognize a ten and not be that impressed by her. Sort of like a very good athlete that isn't that fun to watch. <br /><br />Anyway, George W. Bush struck me as a guy who thought he could use charm and show his good Christian heart to his adversaries and win them over. I found it more arrogant than naive and it really bothered me. I think someone should have told him that while he was sizing up Putin , Putin was sizing him up and coming across as a good old boy isn't always a very strong deterrent. He also thought working with Democrats in Washington would be just like Austin which made me wonder how closely he followed politics outside of Texas in the 90's.<br />But if I'm on the jury I would acquit the Vodka in this one, I think he may have wanted Putin to see the quote and be a little warmer in the next meeting. markhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02083316354675176699noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5794535954827182754.post-62503267932148658772016-05-09T10:23:30.505-04:002016-05-09T10:23:30.505-04:00Runner Katy --
I was semi-joking there, I don'...Runner Katy --<br />I was semi-joking there, I don't really feel bad -- though your stepmom did deserve sympathy.<br /><br />To answer your question, interventions and rehab, I suppose. Though some are beyond the point of no return.John Craighttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08729625146043379286noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5794535954827182754.post-24588270562500663722016-05-09T10:12:21.795-04:002016-05-09T10:12:21.795-04:00Oh I'm sorry, I wasn't trying to make you ...Oh I'm sorry, I wasn't trying to make you feel bad about the post. You are so right about most alcoholics falling into this category and not deserving our pity. I would venture to say that 75% or more fall into this. I just wanted to point out that there are others suffering from depression that turn to alcohol (and end up addicted) that don't show these signs, but other signs. I wonder what (if anything) loved ones or friends could possibly do to help these sad souls? Runner Katynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5794535954827182754.post-70662744317327017072016-05-09T09:56:46.368-04:002016-05-09T09:56:46.368-04:00Runner Katy --
Now you're making me feel bad. ...Runner Katy --<br />Now you're making me feel bad. Your stepmother sounds like a fine person, who just had one vice, but who had a good excuse for wanting to numb herself. <br /><br />Certainly more understandable in a case like hers. John Craighttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08729625146043379286noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5794535954827182754.post-207149978081939672016-05-09T09:34:23.277-04:002016-05-09T09:34:23.277-04:00My step mother in law passed away from alcoholism ...My step mother in law passed away from alcoholism last year and she was not the typical alcoholic, not mean or manipulative or victim playing. She didn't even drink in front of any of us. We all suspected this for years and she would drink when no one was around, to mask the pain of losing her son when he was a new father in his 20's (car accident). Over time, the signs and symptoms were more evident to us, but she thought she was still hiding it well. We didn't know that we could have said or done anything to help her, since she never did anything that caused much harm. She would give away warm clothes and blankets to the local homeless that she actually needed to keep in her own home, and would go on shopping sprees for toys and clothes for my daughter, her granddaughter (what does one say to that? "no, I don't think you should be doing that?") and was extremely loving and generous. Basically, I came to the conclusion that some alcoholics are just committing a slow, sad suicide.Runner Katynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5794535954827182754.post-4919386127084707682016-05-09T06:52:11.105-04:002016-05-09T06:52:11.105-04:00Anon --
You have a point, and I agree with your an...Anon --<br />You have a point, and I agree with your analysis of losing "the love of your life" vs. the inevitable letdown of having her for decades. And yes, sorrow does linger for longer than joy. <br /><br />But I'm not sure the analogy works with alcohol, and alcoholism. Long term use is just debilitating, period, and Manziel is not only throwing away his chance at glory, but at financial stability too. The worm's eye view of life may bring more wisdom than the bird's eye view, but not when it's viewed while drunk. <br /><br />The Rabbi Akiva's saying is true, but I doubt he was referring to drunks. Jews rarely become alcoholic; in fact it was a big part of Jackie Masons schtick on Broadway when he had that one man show that when the show was over the WASPS would go somewhere to drink while Jews would head straight to the delicatessen. John Craighttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08729625146043379286noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5794535954827182754.post-82961661122108633492016-05-09T05:48:04.788-04:002016-05-09T05:48:04.788-04:00I have a lot of envy (no that's the wrong word...I have a lot of envy (no that's the wrong word) let's try "recognition-of-the-special-fun-being-had" vis-a-vis Johnnie Manziel...there is nothing tastier than actually being full of potential, on top of the world, and then throwing it away...<br /><br />it is similar to the difference between having the love of your life for decades (reality and disappointment creep in) versus losing her in some tragic accident near the start, and then the whole episode of the love can be held in your heart like a lightning bolt that you never even saw go out<br /><br />people have a good capacity for sadness, many have a preference for sorrow over joy, you can be sorrowful in a way that constantly renews itself for decades, THAT SELDOM IS THE CASE WITH JOY, sorrow wears better<br /><br />when we look at Manziel we can say "he is a talented boy, who has enrolled himself in a difficult course-of-study, that may produce someone very wise"...or again we can quote the ancient RABBI AKIVA : "The reformed sinner stands in a place that the righteous cannot attain."Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5794535954827182754.post-11746666329939855142016-05-08T22:40:04.938-04:002016-05-08T22:40:04.938-04:00Shaun --
Thank you. I wouldn't be going at any...Shaun --<br />Thank you. I wouldn't be going at any time in the near future anyway, I'm pretty busy at the moment.John Craighttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08729625146043379286noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5794535954827182754.post-63527519427721623972016-05-08T22:32:23.879-04:002016-05-08T22:32:23.879-04:00John - I have gone as a visitor/guest at various p...John - I have gone as a visitor/guest at various points in life. If you go, you should try a couple to get a better sense of them. If memory serves, they do a kind of opening intro round table where you say "Hi I'm John, I'm an alcoholic." You would obviously omit the latter. There is a format and chair person. Shaun Fhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17425084501514329529noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5794535954827182754.post-23535002229286076242016-05-08T21:38:54.895-04:002016-05-08T21:38:54.895-04:00Pavonine --
That makes sense: no matter how smart ...Pavonine --<br />That makes sense: no matter how smart you are, alcohol makes you dumber. So someone with an IQ of 150 may still be smart after a few drinks, just not as smart as he was. John Craighttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08729625146043379286noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5794535954827182754.post-68929099263099087732016-05-08T21:37:15.460-04:002016-05-08T21:37:15.460-04:00Shaun --
I've actually always wanted to go to ...Shaun --<br />I've actually always wanted to go to an AA meeting just out of curiosity, that's been on my list of things to do for a long time. I understand they don't like spectators, though; I suppose I could fake being worried about turning into an alcoholic. <br /><br />You're right, alcohol only exaggerates people's existing characteristic. What's that old expression, there's no such thing as a mean drunk, only a mean person who gets drunk? True enough. John Craighttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08729625146043379286noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5794535954827182754.post-73514062834055366262016-05-08T21:33:46.009-04:002016-05-08T21:33:46.009-04:00Susan --
I've generally avoided alcohol in the...Susan --<br />I've generally avoided alcohol in the past too, though more for health reasons. And while it can add an extra glow, as Steven said, I don't always enjoy it, sometimes it can just make me sort of numb (though that can be useful at times too). John Craighttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08729625146043379286noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5794535954827182754.post-33244462191873606872016-05-08T21:31:16.963-04:002016-05-08T21:31:16.963-04:00Steven --
What you say is true: the world does hav...Steven --<br />What you say is true: the world does have a little extra glow when you've had a couple of drinks, and it does serve as social lubrication in what might otherwise be awkward gatherings. I'm not a teetotaler myself, though I only drink rarely. But I don't like being around drunks when I'm sober, and I've never known an alcoholic for whom I've had any particular regard. John Craighttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08729625146043379286noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5794535954827182754.post-50225054744470455652016-05-08T19:47:37.001-04:002016-05-08T19:47:37.001-04:00The only smart alcoholics I know of were those who...The only smart alcoholics I know of were those who were so bright that they could afford to spare a few IQ points, but while they were smarter than most sober people, there was no way they were at their peak form.<br /><br />There are a lot of alcoholics who drink to cope with trauma, and/or who are genuinely good-hearted, even gifted people, and I have sympathy for them. I wouldn't say, however, that I personally have sympathy for someone who's probably a jerk/idiot even when they're sober. So, yeah, alcoholism in and of itself isn't the pity card some people make it out to be.Pavonine99noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5794535954827182754.post-12641792544393837962016-05-08T18:28:42.459-04:002016-05-08T18:28:42.459-04:00John - That is a pretty accurate assessment of the...John - That is a pretty accurate assessment of the drunk/alcoholic. I wanted to add a significant detail about the physical symptoms. One can actually become physically dependant on alcohol. It’s akin to being a puppet on strings. They become slaves to the idol they serve, which is the bottle. Needless to say all the narcissistic, self-centred behaviour is amplified (especially over years of misuse and all the accompanying enabling behaviour), and the end result can be pretty grim. A person can actually drink themselves to death and you can’t stop them. Which is a very hard thing to watch. There is a strong propensity for the drunks to play victim card, manipulate people, and make excuses. Usually this can improve after they’ve been dried out for some time and can learn to start taking personal responsibility for putting the pieces of their lives together again. But without a family of people that care for you where does one start? Detox? Treatment? AA? Therapy? Man. For example, a former male client about twenty two, - crashed his car drunk, went to work drunk, and showed up in court drunk. Up in treatment initially his attitude was - “No, I don’t have a problem - that’s the way I roll” (or something to that effect). Although his conduct was the norm, for himself, it sure wasn’t normal. Now that he’s out, he has one hard road ahead. What does a twenty two year old guy do who can’t drink or have sex or any form or relationship for one year, and all he has to look forward to is video games, AA, and “sobriety?” And if you’ve ever been to an AA open meeting (I’ve been to some) - they aren’t very inspiring, kind of like a bar - without alcohol, but the same seedy characters. I agree that your sympathy and charity can be better invested elsewhere. I sincerely hope you never see it amongst those you care for.Shaun Fhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17425084501514329529noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5794535954827182754.post-14895576484549002062016-05-08T17:49:40.278-04:002016-05-08T17:49:40.278-04:00Interesting post. I agree. I've always had a...Interesting post. I agree. I've always had a hard time seeing how alcoholism could be a disease. To me, it's a self-induced habit. On my paternal side of the family, we had family members who were alcoholics. For this reason, I make a point of not getting drunk, buzzed. When I start getting light headed, I stop drinking. I drink in moderation because I don't want to develop a drinking disorder.<br /><br />- Susan Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5794535954827182754.post-87763832659954459172016-05-08T16:55:35.482-04:002016-05-08T16:55:35.482-04:00Sometimes when I drink, I become more positive and...Sometimes when I drink, I become more positive and outgoing and then I notice a positive reaction from people. <br /><br />Conversations with strangers can be a lot more fluid and less awkward when both are tipsy. <br /><br />It can be great for bonding. Or for romance.<br /><br />And when you get a bit drunk, you immediately stop worrying about whatever you've been worrying about.<br /><br />When you get really drunk, the much lower inhibitions can lead to...fun.<br /><br />I experience it as a positive in my life and I don't drink that often, sometimes once a week, sometimes not even that. I think it can be a good thing in moderation.<br /><br />If its the first time you've drank in a long while, the euphoria can be a lot stronger. Like any drug. <br /><br /><br />Alcoholism is horribly destructive, and drinking too much is bad for your health, and drunk guys can be a pain, and some can be worse- violent and abusive. There's a massive negative side but I'm glad I live in a non-Muslim society where it is permitted and part of the culture...maybe that's selfish. I know a very good argument can be made against it- far too many people are alcoholics- but when you I'm out and tipsy and the world has a little extra glow, its seems worthwhile. It seems to add something to life for that moment.<br />Stevenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15276736643046430370noreply@blogger.com