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Tuesday, March 25, 2014

Evander Holyfield and steroids

I remember watching the Holyfield-Tyson fights of 1996 and 1997, and thinking how magnificent they looked. Both men entered the ring superbly muscled, each looking like testosterone personified. With Tyson, it was natural; he had been an abnormally thickly-muscled specimen from the time he was 13.

With Holyfield, in retrospect, it was not. He had been the Olympic bronze medalist in the light heavyweight (178 pound) division in 1984, at age 21. He then turned pro, campaigning first as a light heavyweight (175 pounds in the pro ranks), then as a cruiserweight (190 pounds). He won the cruiserweight title at age 24, in 1986. In 1988 he announced that he was moving up to heavyweight.

By the early 1990's Holyfield was a lean 215 pounds. People wondered how he had put on so much muscle so quickly. Holyfield attributed it to his revamped exercise and diet regimen under new trainer Mackie Shillstone.

Here's Holyfield after he had already put on 15 pounds to win the cruiserweight title:


And here here are two pictures of him as heavyweight champion:




You just don't put on that kind of muscle through sparring, hitting the bag, and roadwork. You don't even put it on through weight-lifting.

The dead giveaway with steroids is not just how much muscle you put on, but how it goes on. Steroids always seem to turn the trapezius muscles (which run from the shoulder to the neck) convex, and also give a weird emphasis to the definition between the pectoral muscles.

Here is what Wikipedia had to say about recent allegations that Holyfield had used steroids:

On February 28, 2007, Holyfield was anonymously linked to Applied Pharmacy Services, a pharmacy in Alabama that is currently under investigation for supplying athletes with illegal steroids and human growth hormone (HGH). He denies ever using performance enhancers.

Holyfield's name does not appear in the law enforcement documents reviewed. However, a patient by the name of "Evan Fields" caught investigators' attention. "Fields" shares the same birth date as Holyfield—October 19, 1962. The listed address for "Fields" was 794 Evander, Fairfield, Ga. 30213. Holyfield has a very similar address. When the phone number that, according to the documents, was associated with the "Fields" prescription, was dialed, Holyfield answered.



But we really didn't need all that to know. The only evidence we really needed was visual. 

I point this out because Holyfield is such a perfect example of what steroids do to you: they make you magnificent, in a slightly misshapen way.

None of this, by the way, is to suggest that Holyfield wasn't an extremely brave fighter. He never gave up against the larger, stronger Riddick Bowe, and he wasn't intimidated by Mike Tyson, the most feared fighter of the era. He was in many ways the epitome of a noble warrior; it's just that there was one way in which his nobility was tarnished. 

46 comments:

Anonymous said...

You're right man...I also noticed that every steroid user has that muscle enlarged between shoulders and neck...it's a sure sign...also, in the first fight against Tyson, he absorbed some serious shots from Tyson, yet, it didn't shaked him even a bit...so strange, considering that Tyson was a hard puncher.

John Craig said...

Anon --
You understand perfectly. I, too, was amazed when I first saw that Holyfield was able to stand up to Tyson, especially since he was basically a puffed up light heavyweight. It wasn't until later that I realized why.

Fark Banks said...

Many boxing insiders close to tyson new that . Tyson had asked for a test .

John Craig said...

Park --
Interesting, thanks. I wonder why they didn't test Holyfield. Maybe another case of a self-serving governing board of a sport doing what was best for their sport's image rather than what was right.

Anonymous said...

Not that this still needs to be debated but I think my uneducated position reveals how obvious it is that Holyfield was juicing.

I'm a Tyson fan, always have been, I don't even follow boxing but always found him fascinating and recently went through Mike's entire professional career on youtube from his first fight to this second Holyfield bout.(still have a few left)

Only now, watching the infamous bite-fight did I say to myself "wow when did Holyfield get all jacked, what the hell is up with those crazy neck-shoulder muscles, that looks incredibly unnatural."...so I literally went to google and here I am.

Fuckn pity man, those head butts too, history proves that Evander was the dirtier one...Mike is no saint but it sure as hell makes more sense of the frustrating bites. Who knows what that must feel like to get repeatedly butted in the eye by a juice-freak who because of his steroid use won't even go down when you hit him with shots from the notoriously hardest hitter in heavyweight history.

I really like Mike Tyson, such an interesting fellow. What a hitter.

John Craig said...

Anon --
You're right, it's a pity, at the time of the infamous bite the public reacted as if Tyson were a feral animal and Holyfield the wronged noble warrior. The referee for that fight, Mills Lane, was evidently a big Holyfield fan, so didn't call him for all his head butts, and that's what frustrated Tyson and caused him to bite Holyfield's ear.

I'm a Tyson fan too. I think that he wasn't the bad guy he was always made out to be, at least wasn't' a sociopath like so many people who surrounded him (like don King and Robin Givens). Here's the post I wrote about that:

http://justnotsaid.blogspot.com/2009/10/mike-tyson.html

And here's a post I wrote about how Tyson's image has been rehabilitated in recent years:

http://justnotsaid.blogspot.com/2012/02/rehabilitation-of-mike-tyson.html

Andre said...

I also Google "Evander Holyfield Steroids" to find this blog.

When I saw the Holyfield - Tyson match live I was SO ANGRY because it was visually obvious to me (an all natural NCAA champion track & field d athlete from late 80's) that HOLYFIELD HAD seriously JUICED UP ON STEROIDS! to face Tyson and others.

I was angry at Tyson and his camp for being so naive to face such a cheating athlete. I mean - Holyfield was good to start with. If you give a athlete like Holyfield steroids and if opponents arent also on steroids, Holyfield now invincible.

Holyfield was *almost* invincible against Tyson because Holyfield was a already a world class athlete juiced up on Steroids and possibly HGH and EPO, blood doping, while Tyson was natural specimen.


However, I am glad Tyson did not put his health at risk by abusing drugs to try to beat Holyfield. Furthermore, despite the advantage of steroids, Holyfield faced the real possibility of losing to Tyson in Match II.

Had Holyfield not cheated with the head butts (to open up Tyson's right eye) there is a good chance he would have been KO'd by Tyson in round 4 or 5.

BTW, I supported Tyson's taking a chunk out of Holyfield's ear. Holyfield was on steroids and headbutting. Holyfield is one of those sneaky self righteous cheaters (did you hear him call upon the name of Jesus in the post interview?.

Tyson is a what you see is what you get type of guy.

John Craig said...

Andre --
Well if you were in track and field in the late 80's you must have been very aware of steroids because they were rampant in track, especially sprinting, back then (and still are).

I wouldn't blame Tyson of shaving faced Holyfield. He wanted to be champion again after he got out of jail and the only way to do that was through Holyfield.

I disagree with you on tyson being justified in taking a chunk out of Holyfield's ear, but if you know the background of the fight, it's a lot more understandable.

And yes, Holyfield was the type of guy who was always talking religion and seems dot feel that Jesus would be on his side in a boxing match. A total phony.

Andre said...

IF Tyson trains better and takes Buster Douglas seriously AND if Tyson later goes on PEDs (Performance Enhancing drugs) to match his other steroided oppoments (Holyfield, Lennox Lewis, he would likely have remained undefeated well into the first decade of new millennium.

John Craig said...

Andre --
You think Lewis was on PED's? I always thought he was clean.

Vitali Klitschko actually tested positive early in his career, and never tested positive again, but I always assumed that he was dirty but just never got caught again. And I figured if Vitali was juicing, then the chances are so was Wladimir. But there was nothing about Lewis' build that said steroids to me.

Steven said...

Anderson Silva tested positive for steroids before recent fight:

http://www.sherdog.com/news/news/Anderson-Silva-Tested-Positive-for-Anabolic-Steroid-Prior-to-UFC-183-Main-Event-81275

He's regarded by many as the greatest ever mixed martial artist.

John Craig said...

Steven --
Wow, hadn't seen that. I guess it just came out yesterday. Steroids seem to be very commonplace in Brazil, it's my impression the Brazilian swimmers take them too. I was always under the impression that Silva was clean, though it's not surprising that he might have lost some confidence and resorted to steroids after that horrific broken leg/ankle a while back. MMA seems to be full of guys who were clean for most of their careers and then went over to the dark side as they felt their own natural powers slipping. I heard that Randy Couture may have resorted to them towards the end of his career. Royce Gracie was clean early on, then eventually tested positive. I think Ruas was clean early on, then bloated up later on, looking as if he was juicing.

Steven said...

Yeah I figured as much.

In other Just Not Said related news, Lance Armstrong hit two parked cars in Aspen after a night partying, then blamed his girlfriend.

http://espn.go.com/sports/endurance/story/_/id/12273382/police-say-lance-armstrong-hit-parked-cars-blamed-girlfriend-anna-hansen

John Craig said...

Steven --
Thank you, I saw that. I was debating whether to do a post on it, but there really wasn't much to say other than to post the link, and whenever I just post a link it feels a little lazy.

But maybe I will anyway, thanks.

Anonymous said...

Tyson was on cocaine so it all evens out I think. I also don't think it is fair to say that Holyfield must have taken steroids just because of the time frame. 2+ years is more than enough time to bulk up like that. With that being said his man boobs are pretty suspicious.

John Craig said...

Anon --
Cocaine, while it does help performance temporarily, is not nearly as much of a performance enhancer as steroids are. Also, how do you know that he was on cocaine while he was in the ring?

With Holyfield, I'm not saying he was on steroids just because of the time frame. He was basically caught, red-handed through Applied Pharmacy Services. And, the fact is, once you're fully grown and past the age of 23, it IS virtually impossible to put on that much muscle.

Anonymous said...

Older article but I'll comment that I'm thinking he was on something too. He looked like garbage in the 3rd Bowe fight and the Czyz fight then looks 28 again against Tyson. He may have been juiced before this but was on the wrong kind that might have affected his heart at the time and stamina. There's many different types, I'm sure some can have different side affect for different people

Mike T.

\\\

John Craig said...

Mike T --
I always appreciate comments on older posts. Yes, I'm sure Holyfield experimented a bit. I sometimes think some of these guys juice, then started thinking it's them rather than the juice, and go off it just to prove that it's them, sort of like a schizophrenic who feels normal for a while and goes off his meds. Big mistake.

Anonymous said...

Yeah, that look was of steroids I'll bet. It's just so sickening to see all of baseball, basketball, football - pretty much all sports infiltrated with PEDs. And of course UFC is rampant with drugs.. boxing is too.

There are freaks, however, and Tyson was one of them.

And it's all over private gyms, too, and some of those guys are the most repugnant. What..you can't work hard for it? But there are things you can take these days that absolutely work to increase muscle that are natural. Amino acids before eating and right after lifting are fantastic as they increase protein synthesis. Creatine works too. But you have to lift with these things -there's no substitute for lifting.

Anonymous said...

You should do one of these articles on Rafael Nadal

John Craig said...

Anon --
I don't follow tennis. Is he juiced?

bamminer said...

That address and call really seem eerily suspicious; you must admit. So suspicious that a judge would probably allow it as circumstantial evidence in a murder trial.

I never got to see those fights, but I watched the highlights of Evander headbutting Mike so much in both fights that you thought he was practically using a type of punch as part of the gameplan of attack against Mike. The referees did not seem to say much about it--if anything. If you're a fighter and you're being cheated blatantly and it causes you to mentally blackout each time in the fight, then what do you do? You could see Mike as if he had taken a bomb punch. Maybe Holyfield deserved exactly what he got. I can see how an even tempered man would want to take the law into his own hands, but an irate man(like Mike) might do more and that's what happened. You don't cheat men and expect to reap good things in return. Esp. when that cheating gives you unnatural physical advantage in a sport where its not an unheard of thing for people to die. Such a thing should be punishable by prison and(if you kill the person) it should be akin to drunk driving or more. At least with drunk driving, you're out of it. With PEDS, you're mentally sound and attacking; even though, you know that what you are doing might permanently injure or kill somebody.

If what is said about Holyfield is true, then Holyfield seems almost draconian. To put earning over the welfare of your fellow man makes you like a gangster or mobster. The thing is with PED use is that sometimes it's probably possible that it's the trainers and not the fighter, but--if the reports are true--then you actually can pinpoint that he knew.

John Craig said...

Bamminer --
You make a good point: Mike Tyson was universally regarded as a monster after that fight, but he was simply pushed and pushed until he lost control. One of the lesser known factors in their second fight was that the judge was Mills Lane, an avowed Holyfield fan, and he kept letting Holyfield get away with those butts, which must have made Tyson even more furious.

And yes, that address and name leave little doubt. Plus there's just the visual evidence, as I pointed out.

The one thing I wouldn't fault Holyfield for, though, is putting his own career ahead of the physical well being of his opponent -- all boxers do that, every time they go for knockout. That doesn't exactly make Holyfield unique.

Johnny said...

After watching 30 for 30 I read many articles and the 35-40 lbs he gained had and the veins and his head as well he lost a lot of hair all of a sudden after his thick hair there is a lot of evidence he juiced he proclaims to be all about God but u believe he juiced just looking at his transformation but this is just my opinion. I believed he juiced to beat Tyson if I'm wrong shame on me but I don't believe so.

Johnny said...

Amino acids lubes joints protein works but 35-40 lbs of muscle mass that old come on he was ripped and steroid use wasn't enforced as it is today he lost his hair too in a matter of a year just saying not arguing it adds up but it's all speculation we will never know till we die I suppose.

John Craig said...

Johnny --
You're absolutely right, and thank you for sharing your commonsensical conclusions.

Vinny Pazienza said...

I think it's perfectly reasonable to gain the muscle and weight he did without steroids.. He also grew almost 2 more inches since picture 1 and picture 2. And he had the same "weird pectoral definition" in BOTH pictures, its just more pronounced in the second one, because him muscles are bigger (in both pics there two "holes" or circuloar spots, with one starting at the bottom of the middle of the pecs, and the other deirectly above it).
I'm not saying he Didn't use PEDs but I think just looking at someone at saying that is bullsh*t. This would have been a much better article if you did more research, and hadn't made conclusions before you even researched the article and wrote it (or so it seems, as it comes of as a lot of conclusions that are unable to be proven and just ridiculous to be honest... Stick with the really damning circumstantial and hard evidence (if there is any). As well as witness/friends/associates corroboration and contributions. Live and learn right?

Paddywhacked said...

You are a complete idiot! To say dumb ass statement like that , u need punched in the head. Steroids would have NOTHING to do w/ Holyfields chin &heart in the ring. It's people like you that start lies & rumors that make this "free speech " country ridiculous

Paddywhacked said...

Completely concur Vinny! Complete idiots saying statements they have no idea what they're saying. First one, needs punched in the head for disrespecting EH's ring heart & chin!

Anonymous said...

Yeah, I agreed with pretty much everything article poster said except "And, the fact is, once you're fully grown and past the age of 23, it IS virtually impossible to put on that much muscle."

You lost a lot of credibility with that statement. As having been a personal trainer and exercise/nutrition scientist for a while now, I promise you this couldn't be further from the truth. It is all about diet. Optimal nutrition for gaining lean muscle combined with weightlifting to induce muscle mass. I cannot tell you how many times I have seen men gain that amount of muscle well into their 30's! When Evander got disqualified in the Olympics at 178 lbs, did you not notice how lean he was? The guy looked around 6% body fat if not leaner. The guy was an absolute freak of a specimen and his frame clearly could handle an insane amount of more weight while still being lean.

I don't doubt that he used PED's, he very well may have, but your statement that I quoted above is just absurd. It's all relative to their frame and nutrition plan. The whole concept of a human can only gain X amount of muscle past a certain age is just completely absurd. It's not that black and white and completely relative.

Anonymous said...

Also, to act like Tyson never took any is completely absurd as well. The guy had the power of a mac truck, barely even human. And his size, along with arm development was out of this world. Did Holyfield take them? Quite possible. But did Tyson take them ever? Very quite possible as well. To completely avoid that and act like Tyson never had any thrown in his face either is just completely naive and unfair.

Anonymous said...

I very much appreciate and respect you for not taking my comments the wrong way. Many people get bent out of shape and take things the wrong way.

I will continue to add to this over time...

Bone Density, for example, doesn't peak until at least age 30! It may even be longer (or less), as it is highly genetic and variable (diet/exercise/lifestyle). This isn't even considering Testosterone production, which peaks even later! It as well is highly genetic. Medical Doctors do not prescribe TRT/HRT until into their 40's or over 50 when it naturally starts to decline. Again, highly genetic and variable (diet/exercise/lifestyle).

Also, if you type in Evander Holyfield Steroids, this is one of the first links to pop-up....

If you type in Mike Tyson steroids.... this is one of the first links to pop-up, and I could not have written it any better myself:

http://nattyornot.com/mike-tyson/

How lean Mike was, at his size, in combination with the fact that he didn't even weight train (this was very documented as well) just screams PED's! Even if he did some weight liftings, he was obviously nowhere near as avid of a weightlifter as Evander Holyfield, which easily and obviously contributes to/explains his extremely muscular physique and development, all the way back to his Olympic Fight that he got disqualified in (which he really won and was robbed) when I believe he was only 21 years old. The guy looked like a bodybuilder in the ring.

And I think the most important point of all is, why single out Holyfield when it is quite clear everyone and their brother that had a chance at the title PROBABLY used them at some point in their career? What do you have against Holyfield, or are you just a Tyson fan?

They both harmed their reputation in various ways, did things I'm sure they wish they could take back, and they both handed out some cheap shots at different times, but they are both outstanding fighters. But my thing, and what I will leave you with for now is, Evander Holyfield is the only 5 time Heavyweight Champion of the World in existence.

John Craig said...

Anon --
Okay, you're right, I can't completely rule out Tyson having take steroids. But if you've ever seen the early films of him training under Cus D'Amato as a 13-yearr-old, it's obvious that he was extremely powerful and thickly muscled from an early age, and I think the chances of him having juiced as a 13-year-old under D'Amato are practically nil. The surest sign of steroid use is a drastic change in build after physical maturity has been reached, or a sudden change in performance (especially in the sports in which performance can easily be measured, like track and swimming).

Leanness is something that can be achieved through training and diet, and Tyson was extremely dedicated to his training up until 1986, when he first won the heavyweight title. After that, after D'Amato died and Tyson got rid of Kevin Rooney as his trainer and appointed his buddies as his trainers, and started partying more, things went downhill. But you could see that in his build. Look at the pictures of him in his loss to Buster Douglas, the power was there but he also had a layer of fat enveloping his body. Had he been on steroids, that would not have been there.

I hadn't heard of him admitting that he used a fake penis to pass drug tests after his fights (this was mentioned in the article you linked), that was news to me. But he was a physiological freak from an early age, which is why D'Amato picked him to be a future heavyweight champion.

With Holyfield, it was completely different. He underwent a wholesale change in build well in his mid- to late twenties, and all that stuff in Wikipedia about how he was linked to plied Pharmacy Services speaks for itself.

I am a Tyson fan, by the way: I never thought he was the bad guy that he was made out to be (not that he was any angel either), and I think that a lot of the stuff that he said before fights ("I'm going to eat your children" etc.) was purely for the sake of building up the gate.

I wrote about my take on him here:

http://justnotsaid.blogspot.com/2009/10/mike-tyson.html

But that doesn't mean I disliked Holyfield. He was unquestionably brave in the ring, you can't see his fights against the bigger Riddick Bowe and not come away impressed by his incredible courage. And he always came across like a likable guy in interviews. But at the same time, I don't think there's any question he was juicing, he simply wasn't a natural heavyweight.

As to your question about whether steroid use is commonplace among fighters today, I certainly wouldn't disagree. I think one of the Klitschko brothers actually tested positive at one point, and I wouldn't doubt that that was just the tip of the iceberg. I don't follow boxing as closely as I used to, but I do watch MMA from time to time, and it's pretty obvious that a lot of those fighters are juicing too.

Anonymous said...

John,

Thanks for the response. No one is accusing the guy (Tyson) to have taken steroids at the age of 13, come on brotha.

"Leanness is something that can be achieved through diet and training", uh yeah? Your kinda preaching to the quire here. The problem is, in 1986 as you referred to, Mike was only 20 years old yet he was 221 lbs and so lean he looks around 9-10% bodyfat. Do you understand that that is pretty close to impossible? In combination with the fact that he didn't weight train? Being 221 lbs at that lean naturally is pretty much impossible my friend.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8AJA9qu1Fr0

And that's just one fight, man. Look at the trapezius development of the man (always a huge indicator of steroids). 20 years old man. The guy didn't even really train with weights...

Yes, the guy indeed has admitted to using a fake penis to get around drug tests and has admitted now that he would of (but we all know he probably did) done HGH amongst anything to get an edge. This is on the record.

I don't deny Holyfield most likely used them, but I'd bet just as much on Tyson of having used them as well and its just completely unfair.

Again, he was only 20 years old in that fight man. And I could go back even earlier.....

John Craig said...

Anon --
It is looking more and more as if Tyson juiced. The Al Jazeera expose which just named Peyton Manning as a taker of human growth hormone also named Tyson. I have always given him the benefit of the doubt just because he was physically freakish from a young age, but at this point I wouldn't bet against it anymore. There ARE people who you'd suspect of dong steroids who are actually clean, though. If you say Eugene Sandow today, you'd think he was juicing (and so would I). But he came along long before steroids even existed. And look at someone like Martina Navratilova, the women's tennis star from the 70's and 80's. She looks like a woman on the juice, but she just happened to have an abnormal hormonal mix naturally.

BTW, I have seen videos of Tyson lifting in the past. But, as I said, I would no longer bet he was clean all along.

Anthony Bezona said...

Entertaining comments. Holyfield took PED's through out his heavyweight career no doubt. I wouldn't be surprised if Tyson did as well. The back & forth about Tyson not weight training & this is proof of juicing is idiotic. PED's by themselves don't make you stronger/faster/leaner by putting a needle in your ass & sitting on your couch or doing daily activities. They revive your mussels with no down time so you lift/workout multiple x's a day to build that mussel.

shevy said...

I sorta agree.

Mike always was looking muscular even when he was 16. I don't think he would already roid at 16, so it was more natural and intense training. He also had a great technique and reflexes back then, which I think had a lot to do with training with Cus; Mike was doing worse and worse lateron as far as the technique was concerned, after when Cus was already dead.

Holyfield sorta looked too ripped in the later years all of a sudden. I have never seen such an easy explosion of muscles past age 30. Very likely that he was combining hard training with PED.

Anonymous said...

Look at his breasts. His "doctor" must not have known what he was doing to combat high estradiol. Clearly enhancing to the extreme. Wonder if his body is falling apart now like Ryan Braun.

Anonymous said...

Everyone dumps on holyfield now just like they did back then. Holyfield took numerous drug tests during his career, two at the request of mike tyson and his camp, and passed all. Sure testing technology wasn't as good then as it is now, but there really was not even a shred of evidence that linked holyfield to PED usage. That old wive's tale of holyfield "picking up the phone" when investigators supposedly linked his phone number to a pharma co that was later found to supply athletes with PED's (which was and still is a lot of them), is not nearly enough to confirm that he was doping. I'm not saying that I know without a reasonable doubt that he didn't juice, I just find it very unlikely. Can we maybe accept that the guy had a tremendous work ethic and that he truly DID beat the "untouchable" mike tyson and become a 4x heavyweight champion with sheer will and determination? If not, the least haters can do is respect the man's legacy and what he's done not only for the sport of boxing, but for sports in general. By accusing Holyfield of this, true or not, a huge disservice is done to one of boxing's legends, a man who truly dedicated his life to the craft, and a man who dedicated his life to his God.

Thejist said...

Regarded by many who? A definite great in the sport of MMA but not even close to "the" all time great.

Thejist said...

Ummm why would a steroid lab have evanders number and the address and name almost bang on. Would be enough to have the DA launch a formal investigstion no problem.
But being bias seems to be the main issue here.
Evanders heart and determination were very misguided. He was a brutal hypocrite, a wife beater just like the ones he denounces....... including mike
Evander cheated and cheated ALOT.
After 30 years IN the sport and being under the guidance of Arnie Boehms (the man who created Lennox Lewis) it was a well known situation back then and is even more so now. There is NO way for him to have packed on that much weight in such little time.
After opening my own fitness/Boxing/MMA club in 2000 until present I have become increasingly familiar with HGH in particular.
His body has all the tell tale signs of steroid ABUSE not just use. That with the circumstancial evidence would def be enough to warrant further investigation, if it weren't boxing. And that's the big issue

Thejist said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Thejist said...

Money.......... is what it comes down to.
Before the turn of the century the testing requirements weren't as strick. Seems like the delahoya v Vargas fight and then the weight gains of Shane Mosley and then Manny pacquio was the beginning of the increase in requested tests by clean fighters wanting to be sure they are not up against. Floyd being the one most notable of them. But there is a major problem with having these sanctioning bodies not following their own rules and allowing special treatment and adavantages to the fighter who's promotional and managerial teams have the most money and influence

Thejist said...

He never did.
There is absolutely no evidence whatsoever in regard to Mike Tyson and steroid use. NONE. Not even rumours that snuck out of his camp.
Try to deminish and deflect from the real topic. It says "Holyfield" not Tyson.
And after 30 years in the sport and multiple team trips to the Catskills to get Lennox sparring sessions with Mike there is no doubt in my mind that both fighters were clean their entire career.
Especially Lennox because of the way he was raised as a boxer.
Mike has never had a single indication.
His fight with Mcnealy is the only time he was just ripped muscle definition. He was actually so oveetrained and strip and ripped for that fight out of sheer determination to exact whatever revenge he was wanting.

The ONLY thing mike had ever been penalized for was his fight with Andrew Golota for pot.
You won't ever be able to make the FACTS aprear just because you "think"
There IS CREDIBLE evidence and FACTS that Evander did use steroids his entire heavyweight career. ESP when your winning the bronze medal at 175 and then fighting as a heavyweight at a SOLID 235 3 years later. This is where my schooling comes in. As the owner of a very successful fitness and MMA/Boxing facilty since 2000 and 4 years of college prior to in kinesiology and sports medicine i can assure you that 50lb ofean muscle is an incredible feat for even someone on a know anabolic cycle. All the signs of HGH.

Thejist said...

Is about time people stopped listening to the media about mike and Evander. "Evander is such a saint" is what the going thoughts have been. "Mike is a monster" ESP at that point. Just released from jail for "rape" which there is a ton of issues with as well, first of all she had claimed rape before and was found out to be BS. Tysons lawyer being a "tax attorney" appointed by don king didn't have the smarts to have that entered as evidence.
The law team screwed him hard , this isn't fact but is something I heard and will check into it later was that Tyson sued the law firm for botching it. Will take a look later and add the link.
But I have been in this sport for 30 years, own my own club. Went to school to learn the funtions of the human body through kinesiology and sports medicine, trained beside Lennox Lewis under Arnie Boehm for 6 years before he left for England. We took Lennox down to spar with mike and was one of the nicest people I have event met.
The Hilton brothers were there quite a bit and made mike look like an angel. He said they were the craziest guys he had met, and he's from Brownsville. Lol.
Mike got hosed and is partially his fault for surrounding himself with yes men.
Had he stuck with Rooney and kept with the plan he would have been retired undefeated and prob known as the greatest heavyweight.
Muhammad NEVER thought of anyone but mike filling his shoes. Was very open about that fact. Said had he just stayed away from king and listened to his advice he would have gone all the way.
Mike was a kid. People seem to forget. He was in his early 20s and the most recognizable figure in sports holding, at the time, the greatest title in sports, the heavyweight champion.
But is even more sad that evanders greed and selfish agenda ruined mikes career. Was NEVER in a situation of any real relevance in the sport after that. He was fighting for money after those fights and is the worst reason to box. ALWAYS ends badly for the fighter who has no more love or drive out of love for the sport.
Worried about his future after the mcbride fight. I think he would have won the Danny Williams fight but it was VERY clear he blew his knee out in the second round I believe.
He was looking amazing in that fight and Prior to the fight, Bob Arum made a deal with mike that if he beat willams there was a multi fight deal worth up to a $100 million. He lost and Freddie roach turned his back on him. Rest is history. But I worried that he would end up like the many before him like Joe Louis, broke and alone when he died.
Not a lot of people know that mike went to Arizona after the loss to mcbride broke and homeless pretty much. Well who lived there at the time? Muhammad Ali. Muhammad helped him out and helped him get back on his feet which he has. And I hope it continues that way till his last day on earth. Nice to see people stuck up for him.
He was robbed by so many including a selfish fighter nAmed Evander who mike now helps out a WHOLE LOT with speaking engagements to helping promote his BBQ sauces that will surely fail Unfortunately.

John Craig said...

Theist --
I agree with you about Tyson. You might enjoy the sport which I wrote about Tyson a few years ago:

http://justnotsaid.blogspot.com/2009/10/mike-tyson.html

He was unquestionably painted to be a worse guy than he was, and he was surrounded by truly bad people, like Don King and Robin Givens.